Ford Fiesta ST
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#454189 - 04/08/12 03:53 PM Cold Start Problems
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Hello,

I've had this issue for a few months now, I thought it might be a mapping issue but my recent 165 upgrade hasn't fixed it. Basically my ST is quite rough on idle from cold (doesn't do it any other time). I'm thinking misfire, so potentially spark plugs/leads. I have Denso iridium plugs fitted around 2 months ago, so it could possibly be a dodgy plug?

I've upped a video, please ignore the knocking, as the engine is moving slightly the lid on my airbox is being hit slightly. So just listen to the engine itself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRdJIvsDvQA

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#454190 - 06/08/12 09:16 AM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Anyone got an ideas on this? I'm thinking HT leads myself, I've had a quote off Ford and they want £81+VAT for them :o

I would get some Magnecor ones if I were to pay that.

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#454191 - 06/08/12 09:39 AM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
sxkopite8 Offline
Eat My Du

Registered: 24/01/12
Posts: 8193
Loc: Chelmsford, Essex
im at work mate so cant watch video unfortunately.

mine is a pre facelift ST and would struggle now and again to start, although this is normally after short journeys rather than cold.

however, since i had the 165 fitted shes been fine (touches wood), only time she has struggled was after she hadnt been moved for a week.

im probably not much help to you im afraid
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#454192 - 06/08/12 11:00 AM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: sxkopite8]
nosnow3 Offline


Registered: 11/06/09
Posts: 1930
Left mine for 3 weeks and it started as it normally would... Sounds like a damp issue... Poor ht leads coilpack

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#454193 - 06/08/12 02:02 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: nosnow3]
sxkopite8 Offline
Eat My Du

Registered: 24/01/12
Posts: 8193
Loc: Chelmsford, Essex
Quote:

Left mine for 3 weeks and it started as it normally would...




shouldve worded it better, she started fine but was a very lumpy idle so needed a bit of throttle for a few seconds to tick over comfortably
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East of England Rep

Midge - MG ZR 105 (10-11)
Stella - MR200 Fiesta st (11-15)
Silky - R171 SLK280 (15 - )



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#454194 - 06/08/12 03:51 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: sxkopite8]
Kev Offline



Registered: 01/03/06
Posts: 10490
Loc: Birmingham, UK.
From past threads similar to your issue, members have taken the Throttle Body off and gave it a good clean which sometimes cures the fault
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#454195 - 06/08/12 08:46 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Kev]
YellowBadge Offline
MountooningTipster

Registered: 26/08/07
Posts: 11640
Loc: here
I listened to that very carefully, quite a knocking noise, if you had this exactly before MT then we can rule that out, did sound like the K&N was hitting the top of the CAIS - which they do ! Can turn it slightly to avoid and I my CAIS is soundproofed so the carbon lid is protected from damage.
Anyway, it didn't sound internal to me, does sound misfire-ish or something blowing.
Have them plugs out again and, poor starting and idle sounds like TB, so check that out and clean.
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#454196 - 06/08/12 08:54 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: YellowBadge]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Thanks for all the input guys, I will grab a video of the rev counter tomorrow so you guys can see it moving about. The car starts first time everytime, it's just this rough idle I want sorting.

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#454197 - 06/08/12 08:57 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
sxkopite8 Offline
Eat My Du

Registered: 24/01/12
Posts: 8193
Loc: Chelmsford, Essex
Easiest thing to check then is the throttle body but I would've expected the mechanics to clean it quickly when fitting the kit
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East of England Rep

Midge - MG ZR 105 (10-11)
Stella - MR200 Fiesta st (11-15)
Silky - R171 SLK280 (15 - )



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#454198 - 06/08/12 09:01 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: sxkopite8]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
I cleaned it a while ago, say 2-3 months? It wasn't too bad. How often to HT leads need changing anyway? I think I'm going to order some and see if it does the job, can always send them back for a refund if they don't?

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#454199 - 06/08/12 09:01 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: sxkopite8]
nosnow3 Offline


Registered: 11/06/09
Posts: 1930
can you do a vid of the exhaust at the same time

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#454200 - 06/08/12 09:04 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: nosnow3]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
I can yes, got another camera I can use. Will update the thread tomorrow afteroon with them. Thanks again guys!

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#454201 - 06/08/12 09:24 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
STASON Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 5720
Loc: UK, Essex
hi mate have exactly the same problem as you and im still in the process of fixing it.

i've tried new spark plugs

my old HT leads

new MAP sensor

different fuel

old Throttle body

and still does it

im going to order a new ignition coil pack and if that doesnt fix it im taking it into a garage and likely the engine will be tested and if they cant find the problem im going to get it taken out, and wont be able to drive it until i can afford to put my cosworth engine back in.

other than that i think one of many sensors that records temperatures is knackered.


Edited by STASON (06/08/12 09:25 PM)

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#454202 - 06/08/12 09:38 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: STASON]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Ah, that doesn't sound good

Someone mentioned head gasket, this doesn't sound like that? Not losing any coolant and I've got no crap in my oil.

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#454203 - 06/08/12 10:47 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
jarw101 Offline
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Registered: 25/09/05
Posts: 263
Loc: London, South-East
Idle control valve or throttle position sensor? Not 100% sure if the ST has them?? Common Ford failure. I would gap check your spark plugs ( cheapest and easiest thing to do yourself possibly). I know the densos are pre gapped but best to be sure if they were fitted recently and so is the problem.

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#454204 - 06/08/12 10:50 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: jarw101]
jarw101 Offline
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Registered: 25/09/05
Posts: 263
Loc: London, South-East
Oh and don't forget all metal expands under heat so sounds like spark plug gaps

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#454205 - 06/08/12 11:36 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: jarw101]
STASON Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 5720
Loc: UK, Essex
mine only happens when cold soon as the engine warms up roughly 3-4 minutes the issues dissapear and runs perfectly fine.

Well, if i get the problem fixed Adam i'll let you know.

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#454206 - 07/08/12 07:22 AM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: STASON]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
I've done a quick video today, sound is a bit toss but at around 20seconds the car sounds its worst, the rest of the time it's a bit less violent than that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPFaUfDEfCE

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#454207 - 07/08/12 03:36 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
EssexChelle Offline
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Registered: 24/12/11
Posts: 1787
Loc: Bas Vegas
Mines ruff as anything I thought having my remap would help it hasn't I cleaned my throttle body which was manky as hell this cured it for a while but it's back to lumpy jumpy also my starting issues have returned sometimes starts fine others need some throttle to get her going!!! My mechanic gonna start eliminating things for me now, thinks it could be fuel related as in it's notngetting the right mix!!! Bloody cars always something, I've got a terrible ratltle too had heatshield tightened its not that now been told its my flexi pipe rattling grrrr just had new clutch master and slave cylinder and driveshaft seal replaced then my discs and pads needed doing only had the car 9 months over spend about 3k on it ha ha
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#454208 - 07/08/12 05:56 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: EssexChelle]
nosnow3 Offline


Registered: 11/06/09
Posts: 1930
chelle, looks like you just purchased the car at the wrong moment...

if i was you i'd look at temp sensors and ignition systems before going into fuelling.

has anyone tryed resetting the ECU?

when my 1.4 split a coolant hose i needed my hazards and sidelights because i was in a dangourous situation, this left my battery flat and the ecu of course couldnt maintain its memory... after that though the flat spot i did have at times for overtaking never reared its head again and i had power all the time... Took me 30 minutes of driving to get it to idle again as it forgot how to idle and just couldnt do it!
(what im saying is disconnect the battery with your light switch on and make sure any system in the car is dead and re-connect after 24 hours turn all switchs off before re-connecting battery though)

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#454209 - 07/08/12 08:57 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: nosnow3]
YellowBadge Offline
MountooningTipster

Registered: 26/08/07
Posts: 11640
Loc: here
I have listened very carefully and can now hear the pause in the idleing, could be coil pack on way out, does it actually misfire properly or just that tick over "RRRRR" "RRRRRRRR" ?
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#454210 - 07/08/12 09:01 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: YellowBadge]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
It just does that really, keeps sounding like it's going to stall. I did email Simon today (I said it wasn't anything to do with the kit) just to see if he had any insight.

It's going on a dyno on Tuesday to see what this 165 kit is putting out, we will see if this problem is doing anything else further up the rev range but I don't think it is.


Edited by killeruk (07/08/12 09:03 PM)

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#454211 - 07/08/12 09:08 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
YellowBadge Offline
MountooningTipster

Registered: 26/08/07
Posts: 11640
Loc: here
did he get back to you
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#454212 - 07/08/12 09:13 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: YellowBadge]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Nah he didn't. It would be quite hard to diagnose over email I guess.

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#454213 - 07/08/12 09:27 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: Ad89]
YellowBadge Offline
MountooningTipster

Registered: 26/08/07
Posts: 11640
Loc: here
think it's central email so needs to be made for his attention think.
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#454214 - 07/08/12 09:50 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: nosnow3]
EssexChelle Offline
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Registered: 24/12/11
Posts: 1787
Loc: Bas Vegas
Quote:

chelle, looks like you just purchased the car at the wrong moment...

if i was you i'd look at temp sensors and ignition systems before going into fuelling.

has anyone tryed resetting the ECU?

when my 1.4 split a coolant hose i needed my hazards and sidelights because i was in a dangourous situation, this left my battery flat and the ecu of course couldnt maintain its memory... after that though the flat spot i did have at times for overtaking never reared its head again and i had power all the time... Took me 30 minutes of driving to get it to idle again as it forgot how to idle and just couldnt do it!
(what im saying is disconnect the battery with your light switch on and make sure any system in the car is dead and re-connect after 24 hours turn all switchs off before re-connecting battery though)




My battery was disconnected recently when my clutch was fitted - only know this coz my radio code needed reentering!! Same thing? Or try again? Cheers and yeah i spent too much cosmetically my own fault didn't think of under the hood lol, she 6 years old and 73k so expect things to start need replacing!!!
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#454215 - 07/08/12 10:42 PM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: EssexChelle]
STASON Offline


Registered: 05/01/11
Posts: 5720
Loc: UK, Essex
Adam do you get a distinct smell of unburnt fuel when this is all happening?

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#454216 - 08/08/12 07:31 AM Re: Cold Start Problems [Re: STASON]
Ad89 Offline
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Registered: 06/12/11
Posts: 146
Can't say I remember, nothing too bad, just a slight smell. I can tell you for definite tonight when I leave work.

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